[Coral-List] Hope

[Fisher, Louis]

The problem with attempting to teach "creationists" anything contrary to what they already believe is like beating a dead horse.  Their "truth" has been reshaped and remanufactured so completely to fit their picture such that introduction of any real scientific evidence into their discussion is as impossible as placing the round peg into that square hole.  Can't be done!!!

Lou Fisher






NATURAL RESOURCE SPECIALIST III
BROWARD COUNTY 
ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION & GROWTH MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT
NATURAL RESOURCES PLANNING & MANAGEMENT DIVISION
MARINE SECTION
1 NORTH UNIVERSITY DRIVE
SUITE 301
PLANTATION, FLORIDA 33324
954-519-1255
954-519-1412 fax
lfisher at broward.org 


-----Original Message-----
From: coral-list-bounces at coral.aoml.noaa.gov [mailto:coral-list-bounces at coral.aoml.noaa.gov] On Behalf Of gchallenger at msn.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2009 2:13 PM
To: Les Kaufman; coral-list-bounces at coral.aoml.noaa.gov; coral-list at coral.aoml.noaa.gov
Subject: Re: [Coral-List] Hope

Clearly, there is a lot we know about AGW.   There is also a lot more we don't know.  Sadly, I believe scientists have partly created their adversaries by saying things like accepting AGW infers you are "intelligent and educated" and that those of us who are need to make "difficult decisions" such as "halving the earth's population". 

If scientists stuck to what can and cannot be stated based on evidence and left out words like "truth" and "certainty" and "ignorant", laypeople would be willing to listen to evidence and would also probably agree that some of the possible consequences are indeed compelling.  

Its like Richard Dawkins trying to teach creationists about evolution by calling them stupid......it won't work....ever.

Greg Challenger


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-----Original Message-----
From: Les Kaufman <lesk at bu.edu>

Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:30:20 
To: <coral-list at coral.aoml.noaa.gov>
Subject: [Coral-List] Hope


Hi folks.

As societies go, we are still discovering our toes.  There is little  
chance that with current wiring and awarenesses we will do much but  
react to extreme conditions.  This is entirely a social condition: in  
fact our eyes are capable of seeing our ears of hearing, etc., far  
better than at any other time during our lives.  Hope means that we  
manage to crawl out of the way of our toppling toys before we are  
crushed.

There will be collateral damage.

Les

Dear David:

I feel your pain.  The problem is the high level of ignornace of  
science (your so called educated folks may be educated in business  
but not in how science works) and selfishness:  if you accept AGW as  
true and real, then if you are intelligent and educated you would  
have to do something hard about it, like give up the way you live,  
halve the number of people on Earth, etc etc.  Those are hard choices  
to make so people prefer to take the easy way out and go for the  
controversy.

What I do not know if whether those smug anti-folks like the one you  
debated are sincere in their beliefs or they have an ulterior motive  
(e.g. funded by oil and auto companies).

It is sad and worrisome.  I am reading a book  titled "The Shadows of  
Consumption" by Peter Dauvergne.  It provides great examples of how  
society will ignore and counter scientific evidence for financial  
gain.  If you haven't already read it, I recommend it (I'm only part  
way thru).  Doesn't give me much hope we will see the correct path in  
time.

Alina Szmant

Les Kaufman
Professor of Biology
Associate Director
Boston University Marine Program
and
Senior PI
Marine Management Area Science
Conservation International





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